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PostPosted: Tue Nov 09, 2010 10:34 pm 
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lobito wrote:
Except that "the media and the public and the judiciary seem to be out to get me" is the tale told in English, and a great exaggeration in my opinion.


Yes, but the McCanns are English and I am surmising/assuming from their point of view. Whether it is an exaggeration is just part of that great unsolved piece of the puzzle we won't be able to answer until Madeleine is found.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 10, 2010 1:59 pm 
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tivinho wrote:
lobito wrote:
Except that "the media and the public and the judiciary seem to be out to get me" is the tale told in English, and a great exaggeration in my opinion.


Yes, but the McCanns are English and I am surmising/assuming from their point of view. Whether it is an exaggeration is just part of that great unsolved piece of the puzzle we won't be able to answer until Madeleine is found.


I followed the "tale" both in Portuguese and in English and until the time they left Portugal, sometimes it was like following 2 different stories. That's why I talk of exageration (meaning, the English version greatly exaggerated what the Portuguese press was saying). But I agree that this word "illegally" might be part PR part genuine misunderstanding of what is the usual press behaviour in Portugal. After they were back to UK, the PT press basically reproduced what the UK press was saying.

In any case, I'm starting to wonder if the case is about to reopened or is already reopened (through the request of somebody else, not the McCanns).


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 10, 2010 2:30 pm 
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Kate McCann criticises Theresa May Daily Express

DISTRESSED: Kate McCann has criticised the Home Secretary

Ann Widdecombe
Wednesday November 10,2010

KATE McCann accuses Theresa May of doing too little to find her missing daughter.

Her emotion is understandable but her attack on the Home Secretary is misplaced.

The ball is firmly in the court of the Portuguese authorities, not the British ones.

Our politicians can comment and make representations but they cannot overrule the decisions of the Portuguese, who in turn have said they will act if new evidence is produced.

The Government is not, as Kate McCann puts it, giving up on Madeleine but rather is accepting its limitations over a crime that happened in another country and which is subject to another jurisdiction. Mrs May deserves credit for meeting these distressed parents, not criticism for making her own judgments about what she should then do.



Maddie's parents in meetings today in Lisbon Diário de Notícias

By J.M.O.
10 November 2010

Gerry and Kate McCann, Maddie's parents, arrived in Lisbon today for meetings with their support teams, including the lawyer Isabel Duarte and the communications agency headed by Cláudia Nogueira. The presence of the McCanns in Portugal comes just days after the British couple launched an online petition to pressure the Portuguese authorities and those of the United Kingdom for a review of the case of the disappearance of Maddie, so they can gather new evidence to reopen the same by the prosecutor. In coming to Lisbon, Gerry and Kate McCann are taking the opportunity to give interviews to the media. At the end of the day, they must return to the town of Rothley, in northern England, where they live. Madeleine disappeared on the night of 3 May 2007 in Praia da Luz, Lagos, while her parents dined with friends at a restaurant.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 10, 2010 5:32 pm 
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"Gerry and Kate McCann, Maddie's parents, arrived in Lisbon today for meetings with their support teams, including the lawyer Isabel Duarte and the communications agency headed by Cláudia Nogueira. The presence of the McCanns in Portugal comes just days after the British couple launched an online petition to pressure the Portuguese authorities and those of the United Kingdom for a review of the case of the disappearance of Maddie, so they can gather new evidence to reopen the same by the prosecutor."

Translation: Gerry and Kate McCann arrived in Lisbon today to consult with their lawyer, Isabel Duarte, on the advisability of an appeal on the overturning of the injunction in second instance.

Alternative and more daring translation: Gerry and Kate McCann arrived in Lisbon today for meetings with their support teams, including the lawyer Isabel Duarte and the communications agency headed by Cláudia Nogueira to consult about how to react to th reopening of the case at the request of Amaral/Sargento.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 9:06 am 
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Gonçalo Amaral accuses the McCanns' lawyer of disobedience SOL

Gonçalo Amaral

By Margarida Davim
10 November 2010
With thanks to Joana Morais for translation

The Appellate Court, on October 19, lifted the ban on the sale of the book written by Gonçalo Amaral, The Truth of the Lie. However, Isabel Duarte, the McCanns' lawyer and trustee of the apprehended copies, has failed to return the ten thousand copies to the book publishers.

There are about ten thousand copies of Gonçalo Amaral's book, The Truth of the Lie, which are being kept by Kate and Gerry McCanns' lawyer, even though the Appellate Court has annulled the decision to forbid its sale and distribution.

"It is very peculiar for a lawyer who is a candidate to the Superior Council of the Bar Association [Lawyer's Order] to display this kind of behaviour, failing to obey the decision of a Court", commented to SOL the former Judiciary Police inspector, indignant at not having yet received the books.

Amaral "does not wish to believe" in the hypothesis that the books were destroyed, even though that was precisely what the "McCann couple desired".

According to the daily newspaper Correio da Manhã, Isabel Duarte has delivered an appeal to the Supreme Court of Justice, at the end of last week, alleging that the Appellate Court decision "failed to take into account facts which, throughout the process, were never put in question".

The lawyer believes that "the Appellate Court did not consider the book was written to make money, to deepen the McCann couple's pain and to hinder the investigation".

Gonçalo Amaral has a different opinion: "The non deliverance of the books can constitute a crime of civil disobedience".

The former coordinator of the investigation into the disappearance of Madeleine McCann states that the Appellate Court ruling has no recourse. "The appeal decision would only be admitted has an extraordinary recourse to the Supreme Court of Justice, that is, a recourse of jurisprudence uniformity* if a case law [jurisprudency] existed opposing the decision made by the Appellate Court". Even in that case, the recourse "would not have a suspending effect".



* A non-legalese attempt by a non-legalese citizen to explain a legal recourse Joana Morais blogspot

By Joana Morais
10 November 2010

Jurisprudence Uniformity [Latin iuris prudentia] is a legal recourse in Portuguese Law, 763º article & subsequent in Código de Processo Penal (CPP) - Portuguese Civil Code, used to appeal a Court ruling. As the name implies, there needs to be a case making law, or several, opposing a court ruling which will be used as the 'grounds' - hence the term jurisprudency - for an appeal against said court ruling.

What does this legal recourse mean in this specific case? - basically that the McCanns' lawyer, Isabel Duarte, would have to find similar cases where books have been banned for similar reasons in Portugal and use those cases, as legal evidence and a basis on which to make the appeal to the Supreme Court - which as far as I know it is something that might be hard to find in the Portuguese law, unless one goes to the years previous to 1974, to those 48 years of Portuguese Dictatorship when books were banned and people were threatened into silence, by force.

However, as Dr. Amaral explains in the above article, even then, even if the Supreme Court accepts an appeal made using this extraordinary legal recourse, the facts that remain are:

a) the Lisbon Appellate Court Judges has ordered on October 19, that Dr. Isabel Duarte, the trustee of the previously banned books, must restitute back those copies to the legitimate owner, i.e. Guerra & Paz book publishers;

b) an appeal using the jurisprudency uniformity [Article 768º] has a merely non-staying effect;

c) even if the McCanns' lawyer uses another legalese tactic [Articles 771º to 782º of the CPC] to appeal for an exceptional review of the Appellate Court of Lisbon ruling, which seems to be the case according to to her own statement above; and the appeal to the Supreme is accepted, the law states very clearly [Article 774º] that an application for a review has no suspensive effect.

Therefore, and in a very non-legalese manner: the books should have been returned upon the moment the McCanns' lawyer was notified of the Appellate Court decision which overturned the book ban, and subsequently its sales. And 'ungagged' a Portuguese citizen.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 11:55 am 
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I wonder if the following points could be clarified for me, as I have to confess I am somewhat confused….

Quote:
Paramonte An algarvian girl that lived closely to the McCan´s resort was enterviwed by the PT television about what she saw in the days after Madelaine disapearance. She stated that, after Madelaine dispearance, she noted that the McCan´s would leave the back door of their van opened ajar all night. This was the same van where the dog detected cadaver odour.

I cannot find any report on the above quoted?
What was the girl’s name?
What van were Mr and Mrs McCann using?

Ingles Link
I believe that Mr and Mrs McCann’s lawyer is an extremely professional and skilled individual and feel sure that she may have a very good reason, that is of course, if what is being presently voiced is correct, for her not at the moment to release any books that may or may not be in her and/or the McCann’s possession. Question the word apprehend is being used, therefore, how was this accomplished? I mean the number being stated, is it not, some ten thousand copies (10,000)? Therefore, did they walked into stores and without paying for them merely confiscate them or what? Ali


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 12:24 pm 
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Ali Gator wrote:
I believe that Mr and Mrs McCann’s lawyer is an extremely professional and skilled individual and feel sure that she may have a very good reason, that is of course, if what is being presently voiced is correct, for her not at the moment to release any books that may or may not be in her and/or the McCann’s possession. Question the word apprehend is being used, therefore, how was this accomplished? I mean the number being stated, is it not, some ten thousand copies (10,000)? Therefore, did they walked into stores and without paying for them merely confiscate them or what? Ali


The McCann's lawyer may be professional and skilled, although I am not sure why you would conclude this. She may have a "very good reason" for witholding the books but, if the reports above are true and they belong to the publisher, she is doing so illegally. She is surely guilty of theft. Professional and skilled?

How she got the books in the first place is not really relevant - it is the ownership that matters.

However, I have to say that it now takes a leap of faith to believe any reports on this bizarre case.

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Yesterday the Missus and me had words, I never got to use mine.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 1:27 pm 
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Quote:
Itsmeagain, How she got the books in the first place is not really relevant - it is the ownership that matters.


I am sorry but it is very relevant, in that I cannot see how anyone can just walk into a store or stores and help themselves to 10,000 books (I mean for starters you would need a fork lift truck ). Therefore, how did they come by this very large amount of books? E.g A court order or were they legally purchased and this at the moment for me and perhaps others remains a grey area? Hence my question? Perhaps I should walk into W.H.Smith and help myself to a copy of the Beano Comic and see how far I get...

With regard my comment on said lawyer, may I suggest you read the sort of cases that she has been involved in and the fact that she too is now being somewhat smeared by the media in their suggesting that she is conducting herself in an illegal manner. What a pity and here we go again that the media do not pick up on this particular lawyer's previous cases and skills that she has demonstrated. But as you appear to be saying to my comment, the latter is not worth a mention and therefore, is this not a somewhat one sided view?

As for your last comment in your post
Quote:
However, I have to say that it now takes a leap of faith to believe any reports on this bizarre case.
I whole heartedly could not agree with you more. Ahem. Ali


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 3:06 pm 
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Ali Gator wrote:
With regard my comment on said lawyer, may I suggest you read the sort of cases that she has been involved in ……. Ali


What on earth has the previous cases she has been involved in matter? What matters is whether or not she is failing to comply with a decision of the Court.

Using your thought processes are you also going to say that Harold Shipman was a well respected doctor because he USED to help people get better before he started killing his patients?

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Tip of the day - change all your passwords to incorrect, that way when you forget what it is your computer will tell you "your password is incorrect".


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 11, 2010 3:19 pm 
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:?:


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